cRAW: Is anybody using it?

[DaveTX]

Is anybody out there using the cRAW format? Do you have software that can read the format, or are you using DPP to convert the images to TIFF? My On1 Photo Raw cannot read cRAW files and I haven't seen any indication that there is a plan to support the format. Converting to TIFFs is clumsy.

 

[domv]

not me.

 

[Hanley]

Yes.

I did some testing a couple of weeks ago.

Since getting the R5 I had noticed a real slowdown in Lightroom in terms of performance, despite using 2 decent specced machines:

2017 5K Retina 27 inch iMac - quad core i7 with 40GB RAM
2019 16 inch MacBook Pro - quad core I9 with 64GB RAM

I'd done some tests and found that uninstalling all of the Creative Cloud Apps (just leaving the actual apps installed, Lightroom Classic, Photoshop and Premiere Pro), that performance has picked up considerably.

I also did some export tests using CRAW and RAW files. I found CRAW consistently exports at 33% quicker, despite me not being able to see any difference in image quality or dynamic range, now I'm sure there will be but I can't see it with my eyes.

According to Canon, CRAW (or compressed RAW) uses a lossy-compression algorithm so some data is binned off to reduce file size, however I've been unable to find any noticeable difference at the moment.

RAW - my files sizes generally tend to be up to 60MB

and when I switch to CRAW the files sizes are considerably smaller.

So I know something has to be compromised but I can't see any difference.

So in summary, using CRAW has massively sped up my workflow, smaller file sizes and I can see no discernible difference in image quality or dynamic range.

 

[MaraLee]

I was using the CRAW format due to the claims of smaller file sizes (they definitely are) with no difference in quality and sent a few files to my photographer stepson who loaded the files in LR and compared them to RAW files he was working on. He compared them color for color and found he was not able to manipulate the CRAW files like he could the RAW coming from the same camera. He looked into it more and found the CRAW files to be lacking. I like the smaller file sizes, but I have to admit, I too, prefer the final product with the RAW files over the CRAW after working with both for a while.

I did upgrade my computer to handle the RAW files. My 5yo iMac was having trouble with LR and PS until I added another 8gb of RAM. It did better, but the processor was still pretty slow. Now I have a SSDD and the M1 chip and this puppy flies.

 

[Hanley]

I was using the CRAW format due to the claims of smaller file sizes (they definitely are) with no difference in quality and sent a few files to my photographer stepson who loaded the files in LR and compared them to RAW files he was working on. He compared them color for color and found he was not able to manipulate the CRAW files like he could the RAW coming from the same camera. He looked into it more and found the CRAW files to be lacking. I like the smaller file sizes, but I have to admit, I too, prefer the final product with the RAW files over the CRAW after working with both for a while.

I did upgrade my computer to handle the RAW files. My 5yo iMac was having trouble with LR and PS until I added another 8gb of RAM. It did better, but the processor was still pretty slow. Now I have a SSDD and the M1 chip and this puppy flies.

This is interesting and goes against my extensive testing with RAW and CRAW captures.
I've not found any limitations in image manipulation.

I'd be interested to know what he was having problems with and whether I can replicate them.

Both my Macs are well specced, especially the 16 inch MacBook Pro

2017 5K Retina 27 inch iMac - quad core i7 with 40GB RAM
2019 16 inch MacBook Pro - quad core I9 with 64GB RAM

But even the 16 inch struggles with the full RAW files.

I've just bought my wife an M1 MacBook Air but only the 8GB model, I am going to put Lightroom on it soon, just to see how it handles the RAW files, although with only 8GB I'm not expecting miracles but I will definitely be exchanging my models for M1 devices as soon as they're out.

 

[MaraLee]

This is interesting and goes against my extensive testing with RAW and CRAW captures.
I've not found any limitations in image manipulation.

I'd be interested to know what he was having problems with and whether I can replicate them.

Both my Macs are well specced, especially the 16 inch MacBook Pro

2017 5K Retina 27 inch iMac - quad core i7 with 40GB RAM
2019 16 inch MacBook Pro - quad core I9 with 64GB RAM

But even the 16 inch struggles with the full RAW files.

I've just bought my wife an M1 MacBook Air but only the 8GB model, I am going to put Lightroom on it soon, just to see how it handles the RAW files, although with only 8GB I'm not expecting miracles but I will definitely be exchanging my models for M1 devices as soon as they're out.

It was reds/oranges in particular he said were breaking down when he tried to enhance them in post. The tones he was trying to get just weren't there. He sent me images as examples and he was right. Especially in images with black skin tones with bright red or bright yellow clothing, the CRAW does not perform as well as the RAW files when adjusting. He is a portrait photographer in Jamaica and has a lot more experience in that aspect than I do.

 

[Hanley]

It was reds/oranges in particular he said were breaking down when he tried to enhance them in post. The tones he was trying to get just weren't there. He sent me images as examples and he was right. Especially in images with black skin tones with bright red or bright yellow clothing, the CRAW does not perform as well as the RAW files when adjusting. He is a portrait photographer in Jamaica and has a lot more experience in that aspect than I do.

Hmm, that is interesting, I'll have to do some more testing.
I guess the initial exposure of the image is important but if he's an experienced photographer it won't be that.

 

[MaraLee]

Hmm, that is interesting, I'll have to do some more testing.
I guess the initial exposure of the image is important but if he's an experienced photographer it won't be that.

He's experienced. He's new to mirrorless and the cRAW format, but he's been working with Raw files for years.

 

[Greg]

I have read all the above. If you are concerned about image size and computer power may I suggest you read my very recent post:

Thread 'FREE Alternative to Photoshop etc.' https://rfshooters.com/threads/free-alternative-to-photoshop-etc.911/

 

[Hali]

My understanding is that CRAW is lossy in compression which means you do lose information. How much is questionable but it is not truly lossless.